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Poco Forums • View topic - Update!

Update!

Discussion not related specifically to one of the topics below

Moderators: Eric, Tomas, robin

Update!

Postby Slaven » Sun Aug 31, 2008 1:38 pm

I'm cutting it close with my promise to update you all at the end of this month, as we're still working through some of the items I wanted to talk about. I'll be brief and fill in the gaps in the coming weeks :)

We had quite an eventful year, some of it good and some of it bad. Our attempt at PocoMail 5 codebase came to a halt earlier this year as for the first time we tried to outsource part of the functionality to another development house. The basic reason why things fell apart was probably our over-ambitious plans. We had nothing else to do but learn from that experience and lick our wounds!

Meanwhile, or maybe as a result of, Poco Systems Inc has started a process of change of ownership so that it can be more competitive and provide long-term future for PocoMail codebase. While the nitty-gritty details are private rest assured I'm still around! This will also lead to an overhaul of our website, branding, etc. so expect some changes going forward.

Finally, as we got bogged down with version 5 that code branch had to be forked many months earlier from 4.x codebase, so there was no easy way to put out another minor update to 4.x without rewriting it again. This is why you didn't see any updates to 4 this year. That said, when we realized where we were with version 5 we started working on our plan B: another minor update with some of the cool features from 5 that didn't require the new plumbing version 5 had, and fixes to some of the often-reported annoyances with 4.

Unfortunately, some of the fixes and new features we wanted to deliver do need the new plumbing we are working on for version 5. We didn't want to just "bump" this new update to 5.0 and forget about what we wanted to achieve for version 5, so the upcoming 4.8 will be a free update. Tomorrow 4.8 starts its private beta for a couple of weeks then it will appear in our Beta forum for proper testing. I'll post the feature change list soon as well.

So what's the deal with 5.0? Since we got busy with 4.8 we didn't have much time to worry about 5, but later we will be revising our plans and looking at a more "realistic" feature-set. We also may take the time to hop to a newer Delphi release, but that's not for certain yet.

Phew, that's about it! :)
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Postby Kevin Tea » Mon Sep 01, 2008 1:54 am

Slaven

Blimey! Been through the wringer a bit!

Looking forward to 4.8 beta ...
Regards
Kevin
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Postby mcrain » Fri Sep 05, 2008 6:53 am

I am a bit surprised at the lack of response/comments to this thread. There have been so many inquiries as to the next version of Poco/Barca that now that it has been mention by the author the response is so quiet.

I for one am very interested to see what 4.8 brings, but even more interested to see what comes of things with the 'change of ownership ' mentioned in Slaven's post.

I hope the lack of discussion around this thread doesn't mean a lack of interest and subsequent erosion of the Poco/Barc customer base.

I am looking forward to the coming events.
--
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Postby Kaigan » Fri Sep 05, 2008 11:21 am

mcrain wrote:I am a bit surprised at the lack of response/comments to this thread. There have been so many inquiries as to the next version of Poco/Barca that now that it has been mention by the author the response is so quiet.

I for one am very interested to see what 4.8 brings, but even more interested to see what comes of things with the 'change of ownership ' mentioned in Slaven's post.

I hope the lack of discussion around this thread doesn't mean a lack of interest and subsequent erosion of the Poco/Barc customer base.

I am looking forward to the coming events.
--
Mike

I am surprised as well by the lack of comments on Slavens announcement.

I am also looking forward to what 4.8 brings, but have been quite busy of late and am hoping that the beta comes sooner than a couple of weeks. If not, due to an upcoming course, I won't have a real chance to play with it till the end of October. :(

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Postby Andreas » Fri Sep 05, 2008 5:22 pm

Okay, here is my opinion: If v4.8 doesn't bring strongly improved HTML support (with a new editor), then it's just a waste of time for me. Sorry.

v4.5 is more or less fine for me, except the HTML editor. That's the only feature I'm really waiting for.

Slaven's statements about v5.0 don't sound good. It seems he no idea how to reach this target.
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Postby Tomas » Fri Sep 05, 2008 8:20 pm

Andreas wrote:Slaven's statements about v5.0 don't sound good. It seems he no idea how to reach this target.


I understood it that v 5 is in certain stage of development already. But that now he is busy with 4.8/2.8, thus he will come back to 5 once 4.8 is done, that's only logical. Also as the unfruitful outsourcing part he mentions, probably also meant an extra unbudgeted time spent on 5, he will consider cutting down on some features planned for initial release of version 5 in order to cut down some time from delay on version 5 = so that v.5 could be released earlier.
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Postby robin » Fri Sep 05, 2008 9:11 pm

Andreas wrote:Okay, here is my opinion: If v4.8 doesn't bring strongly improved HTML support (with a new editor), then it's just a waste of time for me. Sorry.

v4.5 is more or less fine for me, except the HTML editor. That's the only feature I'm really waiting for.

I do agree with Andreas' comments about HTML mail. Having got used to slick handling by Outlook of HTML mail (which I use at work) Poco is a little clunky. But I'll still take a look at v4.8.
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Postby roadrunner » Fri Sep 05, 2008 9:15 pm

I am so thankful that Poco/Barca has not been discontinued. Ususally three or four times a week, I check the forums to keep me updated. Yes, I have been one, too, to complain of no updates

We do need a replacement for MS Outlook and Outlook Express, and we do need a software with updates or upgrades. Outlook and Outlook Express has its quirks, as well, and we people have our quirks. Everything needs improvements, me, too.

Slaven, you started with something fantastic-keep it going.

Have a wonderful day.


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Postby Bruce » Sat Sep 06, 2008 6:36 am

Andreas wrote:Okay, here is my opinion: If v4.8 doesn't bring strongly improved HTML support (with a new editor), then it's just a waste of time for me. Sorry.

v4.5 is more or less fine for me, except the HTML editor. That's the only feature I'm really waiting for.


I agree. I am very tired of correcting PM's mishandling of blockquotes and languages.
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It's about time...

Postby skerns » Sat Sep 06, 2008 9:11 am

I've been looking for an update, or new version for some time, and have been more than frustrated at the lack of communication from Slaven / Poco Systems.

Poco isn't perfect, but it's the best software I've found and it deserves to be maintained. Finally, we get a partial answer and will hopefully see some forward motion very soon.

So now I'm waiting (impatiently) for the 4.8 version to hit the open Beta test.

Keep it movin, please...

Scott
Meet me at Stonehenge at midnight, I'll bring the goat!
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Postby chrisretusn » Sat Sep 06, 2008 2:37 pm

I really saw no reason to comment. Slaven gave us the scoop and I for one am excitedly waiting the 4.8 release whenever that happens. Right now I am quite happy with PocoMail. I can wait as long as it takes for the next release. I for one prefer quality rather than a quick put together release just to satisfy the impatient.
Chris

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Postby RBernier » Sun Sep 07, 2008 9:51 pm

mcrain wrote:I am a bit surprised at the lack of response/comments to this thread. There have been so many inquiries as to the next version of Poco/Barca that now that it has been mention by the author the response is so quiet.

--
Mike


I don't expect 4.8 to bring any improvement in the handling of IMAP. I'll look at 4.8 when it is released, and hope I'm wrong, but I'm not even confident that we will see improved IMAP support in version 5. An email client that cannot effectively handle IMAP is useless to me.
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Postby aderoy » Sun Sep 07, 2008 11:30 pm

Add another wish for better IMAP support. This is one item that holds me back. Another is threading with large mail folders (2K - 16k) is very slow. I have 114 folders with approx 3GB of data for this year alone.

As fopr HTML - Outlook 'handles' it better (if that is what you think) due to the use of Internet Explorer engine -- with all the security risks. Rather be safe from HTML malware via Poco than not. Poorly formatted / generated HTML which by the way is for webpages not email, is a problem that can be fixed by the sender not the enduser.

Yes I am one of 'those people' who uses text and attach any graphical and/or document to e-mails.

There is room for everyone. Waiting to see what transpires.
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Postby Flashfox » Tue Sep 09, 2008 12:43 pm

Thanks Slaven for the update. Based on what you guys went through, it must have been hard. The good news is that you are still around and hopefully your ownership change will maintain the high quality of PM and Barca.

I suspect that the new ownership also means a new influx of capital which is good news for a company who is working in such a niche market. I look forward to hear more about the changes as you deem they can be published.

Product wise, I don't know what will be in 4.8 (2.8 for Barca?), but I am hoping for IMAP and compatibility with ActiveSync (Windows Mobile 6.1). But then again, I can dream can't I :D
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I've been thinking...

Postby skerns » Tue Sep 09, 2008 2:22 pm

I've already posted a reply, and while I am looking forward to the update, I guess I need to add to my initial response.

The news that PocoSystems is coming under new ownership fills me with both excitement and dread. It could mean, as someone already mentioned, influx of capital to further development.

On the other hand, it could mean a complete 'reboot' of the program I've come to depend on.

To elaborate, if Yahoo is buying Poco (and I can't think of a reason they would), I'll just leave the program behind and look for a replacement.

Yahoo has a particularly bad habit of buying a product (and it's dev team), (re)branding it, then screwing it up so badly it becomes a shadow of it's former self, then abandoning the devs and / or the software. Case(s) in point, MusicMatch Jukebox, and Konfabulator. Both were independent developers with an exceptional product with a large user base.

After purchasing MMJ, Yahoo released Yahoo Music Jukebox, which MAY have used MMJ underlying code, but completely lacked any recognizable feature of MMJ. and did an incredibly poor job of organizing, ripping, and burning music, a GIANT step backward for a company that just purchased a feature packed, robust product like MMJ. Yahoo, then disenfrachised all the owners of MMJ (myself included) by cutting off any support for the late MMJ. Nor did they offer any refund, or compensation to recent purchasers of MMJ.

Konfabulator, purveyor of desktop Widgets was purchased by Yahoo about two years ago. After pushing out two bug-riddled Yahoo branded updates and a total, (and poorly designed) overhaul of the (rebranded) website, Yahoo then 'let go' original programmer/founder, and then started reassigning the remainder of the dev team to 'other projects', leaving the newly rechristened program and website to languish, at least on the development side. The user base kept chuggin away, writing new widgets, only to find themselves in purgatory with an owner with little, to no motivation (or apparent obligation) to update the program or website they had revised. Recently Yahoo brought back the original programmer, with a 'HUGE' announcement which turns out to be widgets on your TV! Apparently, Yahoo is putting all future development of the widget engine into / onto the bigger market of television.

So, you can clearly see my point. I hope Poco Systems found someone with some capital to invest, for the betterment of a pretty good piece of software, not some (TOO) big company with wads of cash to wave under Slaven's nose.

Slaven, I guess it would be nice if you could please tell us more about this. If you'd prefer to reply privately, just to either to let me know the bad news, or to reassure me, that's up to you.
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