Advertising in sent message?

[Victor Dewsbery]

I replied to a message from a client.
In the headers of the message as stored in the Sent box, I find a reference to the URL www.pocosystems.com.

How can I see the format of the message that my client will see? Is this URL displayed to my client, and if so, how and where in the message?

Is this URL automatically included in outgoing messages? Can it be disabled, or are we stuck with mandatory advertising?

[Eric]

How can I see the format of the message that my client will see? Is this URL displayed to my client, and if so, how and where in the message?

It will be only visible in the headers.

Is this URL automatically included in outgoing messages? Can it be disabled, or are we stuck with mandatory advertising?

Yes, but only in the trial.
If you purchase it, it will be eliminated or you can change the url to your taste.

[Victor Dewsbery]

Is this URL displayed to my client, and if so, how and where in the message?
It will be only visible in the headers.
Is this URL automatically included in outgoing messages? Can it be disabled, or are we stuck with mandatory advertising?
Yes, but only in the trial.

Why in the headers? I could understand a footnote being added to the bottom of the mail, but adding a pocomail header is a sure way to confuse my many clients. I'm afraid this is a killer bug for me. Combined with the lack of "on-the-fly" message sorting, things don't look too good at the moment.

I'm now looking at Thunderbird. Visually not as good as Barca (at least not up to now), and without any calendar etc., and I have critical questions there, too (about encoding, message layout etc.), but it is not "nag-the-recipient-ware" and I can sort messages on the fly.

[Eric]

Why in the headers? I could understand a footnote being added to the bottom of the mail, but adding a pocomail header is a sure way to confuse my many clients. I'm afraid this is a killer bug for me.

Don't understand why that would be a killer bug
It's not obstrusive at all. It's just included in the headers, so it's not immediately visible.

Sent yourself a message and when clicking on headers you'll see it.

Combined with the lack of "on-the-fly" message sorting, things don't look too good at the moment.

Unfortunately at present I can't give you a response as to whether it will be available.

I'm now looking at Thunderbird. Visually not as good as Barca (at least not up to now), and without any calendar etc., and I have critical questions there, too (about encoding, message layout etc.), but it is not "nag-the-recipient-ware" and I can sort messages on the fly.

Barca is not a nag-the-recipient-ware, as you said it. It doesn't nag you at all, nor your recipients.

If TB works for you the way you want, then that's your choice.
For me it's Barca Pro at home and Outlook at work, although I would prefer Barca over Outlook at work.

Hope you'll find what you're looking for & do have a nice weekend.

[Victor Dewsbery]

Eric,

Thank you anyway for taking the time for such careful explanations.
This forum is certainly a friendly and helpful place. Even if I go for T-Bird, I may look by again in a few months time to see if any progress has been made.

As to the headers, I am not sure in Barca what is visible to e-mail recipients and what is not - and sending a message to myself would not really show me, at least not in Barca, because I haven't worked out what is optionally visible - and otherwise hidden - and what is always visible. But for me (based on my experience of Outlook so far), anything that is visible in the headers is seen at the top of the message, i.e. before the message text, and I would not like to have advertising at that point in the message. Advertising in a footnote beneath the message would be acceptable - it is an established convention that is used by some virus programs and by mailing services such as Yahoogroups (and it could even include an advertising slogan in addition to the URL). But not at the top or in the headers.

[Eric]

Eric,

Thank you anyway for taking the time for such careful explanations.

My pleasure Victor.

This forum is certainly a friendly and helpful place.

We try to keep it this way.
Wouldn't want it otherwise.

Even if I go for T-Bird, I may look by again in a few months time to see if any progress has been made.

Please do!
The beta may take several months before it's released. All depends on what problems may occur during that period.
Not forgetting the upgrade on which Slaven is working too, but that will take a little longer, so not for this year.

But for me (based on my experience of Outlook so far), anything that is visible in the headers is seen at the top of the message, i.e. before the message text, and I would not like to have advertising at that point in the message.

Nope, it's not seen at the top of the message. Only if you display the full headers will it show.

Advertising in a footnote beneath the message would be acceptable - it is an established convention that is used by some virus programs and by mailing services such as Yahoogroups (and it could even include an advertising slogan in addition to the URL). But not at the top or in the headers.

Don't know anything about conventions, but maybe it's something to address to PSI directly, so they can change it for future trial versions.

Till next time.

[Tomas]

But for me (based on my experience of Outlook so far), anything that is visible in the headers is seen at the top of the message, i.e. before the message text, and I would not like to have advertising at that point in the message. Advertising in a footnote beneath the message would be acceptable - it is an established convention that is used by some virus programs and by mailing services such as Yahoogroups (and it could even include an advertising slogan in addition to the URL). But not at the top or in the headers.

I would personally find footnote ads absolutely unacceptable.
Footnote ads are ads. X-URL header is just one of the tens of header lines in email message, that (almost) nobody gets to see.

I might be wrong but I don't think many other email clients display X-URL by default to the recipient.
My installation of Outlook 2002, no modifications to default install, doesn't show it. Out of the tens of header lines that any random message contains, Outlook 2002 only displays From, To, CC and Subject by default.
It's just one of those tens of obscure x-headers that nobody actually uses.

[Tomas]

Don't know anything about conventions, but maybe it's something to address to PSI directly, so they can change it for future trial versions.

I think people would flood Pocosystems helpdesk with complaints if that would be changed.
Ad is an ad. Annoying.

X-URL is very unobtrusive. In fact I don't think it has any advertising effect whatsoever for Pocosystems, it's something closer of an "easter egg" you might find in some applications.

[Eric]

I think people would flood Pocosystems helpdesk with complaints if that would be changed.
Ad is an ad. Annoying.

I agree Tomas.
Didn't know there's a convention about adding that info, so I wonder.

Wouldn't want it as a footnote either, since that's more like you know what email client I mean.

X-URL is very unobtrusive. In fact I don't think it has any advertising effect whatsoever for Pocosystems, it's something closer of an "easter egg" you might find in some applications.

Never saw that URL in all those email clients I tried.

[mcrain]

I think it is important to point out in the case of the X-URL in the header that it is only in the header in the unlicensed trial version of Poco/Barca. Once a license has been applied and you do not congfigure a URL of your own, this header will not appear in outgoing messages. Short story, if you don't want the URL in the headers, purchase a license. While in trial period you will see this in the headers. But it will not be seen in the standard display in any mail client unless the recipient of the mail item explicitly searches the raw message or explicity configures their mail client to display the X-URL header specifically.

I was concerned about it as well when I first trialed poco a few years ago, until I fully understood why and when it was there.

[Victor Dewsbery]

When I first saw the URL, I thought it was displayed to clients in the header of all messages (similar to the way it was displayed on my screen in Barca) (':('). It is a relief that the users who report here say that they can't see it in other mail programs (':D')(':D'). If it is just there in the long form of the headers, together with the mailing time and all the stages through which the message has been passed, that is perfectly OK. Even with other mail programs, I believe that the long form of the headers tells you what program the mail has been created with, so including the URL in the long form of the headers is no problem (and it would even be OK to continue to show it after a licence has been purchased).

After mcrain's suggestion about how to move messages to folders on the fly, I have returned to Barca and am again testing it as my default mail program. So perhaps I'll be sticking around after all. ('8)')

[Mischa]

well, it may not be visible, I just received a undeliverable mail message because the mail was marked as spam. since the mail containd only basic tekst without the s*x-words and things, it can only be caused by the URL in the header. so it can cause some problems with certain spam-filters. purchasing the full version is probably the only solution.

[Tomas]

since the mail containd only basic tekst without the s*x-words and things, it can only be caused by the URL in the header. so it can cause some problems with certain spam-filters. purchasing the full version is probably the only solution.

It can't be excluded, but it doesn't necessarily have to be the reason. Spam filters also take many clues from message headers (particularly those added by your outgoing server and other servers on the way to the destination).

[Mischa]

I have to correct my post.. I used a template with two GIF images. After deleting the images, the mail was received correctly. I have to test some more with those templates I guess.

[sixit]

Eric,

As to the headers, I am not sure in Barca what is visible to e-mail recipients and what is not - and sending a message to myself would not really show me, at least not in Barca, because I haven't worked out what is optionally visible - and otherwise hidden - and what is always visible. But for me (based on my experience of Outlook so far), anything that is visible in the headers is seen at the top of the message, i.e. before the message text, and I would not like to have advertising at that point in the message.

Hi Victor,

I think you are experiencing confusion over the term "headers". Unlike Microsoft Word (or other text editor) headers are not displayed above the text. Instead, they are specialized information designed to give information to various systems and to act as a "log" of the email's travel.

Typically they are never visible to the user. HOWEVER, having said that you also need to know that control of the headers' visibility lies with the recipient and the software used to view the email. Most good professional software, Microsoft Outlook excluded, makes it very easy to view the information stored within the headers; this is something you've found to be true in Barca. However, unless your recipient is technically-minded, most won't ever even know what a header is or that their emails have them. (Go ahead, ask them... They'll look at you funny.)

Hope this helps,
Robert~